The Wonderland Board

Before you read: don't say I didn't warn you that this may hurt you. I've written what I thought. And I didn't mean the specific person, but the whole community.

The forum is full of level textures and other stuff. Unfortunately, many of them isn't worth much: random mess of shapes made with MS Paint looks rather ugly.

Post things worth downloading. To make brick texture doesn't mean to paint the background red and make few white lines. Better way is to find image in the net or in the WA data and then modify it. Unfortunately, here MS Paint won't come handy. You'll need some more advanced graphic tools (personally I reccomend freeware version of PhotoFiltre).

I wish you good luck in making great textures. Get rid of Paint and start using your imagination. Let the limits disappear!

Also I'd like to congratulate all talented makers. Keep up the good work!

Eeeh,
I use Microsoft Paint, But I zoom in to the mazimum and do it pixel-by-pixel.
This helps a lot when you want to get all the tiny details.
But this is only temporary, I lost photoshop when my computer resetted.
>_<
But I'mma go look up BETTER image editors now.

Yay, you exist! And I agree with you here, I was just worried if I said it I'd be running from a storm of angry kids or something.
Also, I recommend GIMP for an image editor, it has all the things you need and more.
One last thing: ANTI-ALIAS EXISTS!! :C

I suggest paint.net You can download a bunch of plug-ins like me and create a few layers on things you don't want to change.

Double post DARN YOU LAG!!!!!!!!

Pawelec wrote:Before you read: don't say I didn't warn you that this may hurt you. I've written what I thought. And I didn't mean the specific person, but the whole community.

The forum is full of level textures and other stuff. Unfortunately, many of them isn't worth much: random mess of shapes made with MS Paint looks rather ugly.

Post things worth downloading. To make brick texture doesn't mean to paint the background red and make few white lines. Better way is to find image in the net or in the WA data and then modify it. Unfortunately, here MS Paint won't come handy. You'll need some more advanced graphic tools (personally I reccomend freeware version of PhotoFiltre).

I wish you good luck in making great textures. Get rid of Paint and start using your imagination. Let the limits disappear!

Also I'd like to congratulate all talented makers. Keep up the good work!

I KNOW you're referring to me primarily, you don't have to be so evasive! I am not easily offended by what I read. I'll stop using MS Paint for mine from now on, OK?

Even tile making software can be helpful

llarson wrote:Double post DARN YOU LAG!!!!!!!!

Only click the "post" button once. If nothing happens, reload the page and see if your post registered.

I agree with Pawelec. Some of the new textures on this forum look awful in levels.

Wonderman109 wrote:I KNOW you're referring to me primarily, you don't have to be so evasive! I am not easily offended by what I read. I'll stop using MS Paint for mine from now on, OK?

Not only to you, there are many MS-Painters around.
Honestly, I meant someone else...


I opened the forum today and found one new Paint-Tex... This one wasn't so bad however.
BTW, I love Dark Drago's Wonder Forest tex. A few tweaks to make it fit the theme of my levels and I'll make it my personal default...

All he does is mash MS' textures together and recolor them, others like ab-47's textures don't get as much attention, and those are mostly hand made. While I agree that particular texture is nice, pretty much all of his others are mashed up or recolored, a lot of users here are too easily pleased, and when I said "all he did was some recoloring, it isn't that great," I get pm'd by Dark Drago about how I "don't appreciate his works." This hypocrisy, I guess that's what it is, is one of the reasons I consider leaving now.

DP

StinkerSquad01 wrote:All he does is mash MS' textures together and recolor them, others like ab-47's textures don't get as much attention, and those are mostly hand made. While I agree that particular texture is nice, pretty much all of his others are mashed up or recolored, a lot of users here are too easily pleased, and when I said "all he did was some recoloring, it isn't that great," I get pm'd by Dark Drago about how I "don't appreciate his works." This hypocrisy, I guess that's what it is, is one of the reasons I consider leaving now.

At least he can do that much; with MS Paint you can't even mesh together different textures. If I could do that, I'd make a few textures like that so it's easier to make scenery.

It's true; Drago is definitely being inappropriate. I haven't seen the post where he says that, but it gives him a label. I cannot stand people who are like that either.

He did work hard on it like I worked hard on my WACC2 and MNIK told me it was unacceptable. I was cool with it, DD isn't apparently. But he's not completely at fault and he at least tried. Don't blame him entirely or he'll want to quit like you do right now.

And Drago DID seem like a nice person until I read your post.

But you, SS01, tend to word things in a very demeaning way when you criticize. That's worse than my 'bad attitude.' So did Little Z-Bot and Emerald once (but that was only ONCE.) Most of the other main users here (By that I refer to MNIK, Emerald, llarson, yot yot 5, Nobody, Pawelec, Ab-47, Derp, and Yzfm. I haven't gotten many replies from Ice or Little Z yet, but still...)

You have told me and sometimes other people many times that I/we did something wrong, did it badly, or otherwise inappropriately, in a very inappropriate way yourself. Other people worded it nicely. Like any normal person, I was upset at my mistake, but I fixed it and responded positively because the person who pointed out my mistake did so nicely but seriously.

I don't want you to leave, but I would appreciate you being a little kinder. But I can't and won't stop you, so make your choice wisely.

If you choose to get upset because you feel offended, tell me politely, and I'll avoid it, OK?

But don't expect I'll quit myself for whatever reason cuz' I just joined the forums last Saturday.

I think I've said enough; I don't want anyone getting bored reading this.
If anyone thinks somehow that I'm being controversial, feel free to tell me.

At least he can do that much; with MS Paint you can't even mesh together different textures. If I could do that, I'd make a few textures like that so it's easier to make scenery.

You can do that in paint.

He did work hard on it like I worked hard on my WACC2 and MNIK told me it was unacceptable. I was cool with it, DD isn't apparently. But he's not completely at fault and he at least tried. Don't blame him entirely or he'll want to quit like you do right now.

While I do appreciate the fact that he spent time on it, I find it unfair that he gets more attention for recolorings and mashings than others for handmade things.

But you, SS01, tend to word things in a very demeaning way when you criticize. That's worse than my 'bad attitude.' So did Little Z-Bot and Emerald once (but that was only ONCE.) Most of the other main users here (By that I refer to MNIK, Emerald, llarson, yot yot 5, Nobody, Pawelec, Ab-47, Derp, and Yzfm. I haven't gotten many replies from Ice or Little Z yet, but still...)

Most of them what?

You have told me and sometimes other people many times that I/we did something wrong, did it badly, or otherwise inappropriately, in a very inappropriate way yourself. Other people worded it nicely. Like any normal person, I was upset at my mistake, but I fixed it and responded positively because the person who pointed out my mistake did so nicely but seriously.

If you choose to get upset because you feel offended, tell me politely, and I'll avoid it, OK?

I'm sorry, but I'm just getting fed up with all these little kid members. I'm not willing to go into detail.

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llarson wrote:DELETED DUE TO REGRET

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DEEMAN223344 wrote:

llarson wrote:DELETED DUE TO REGRET

Why do you want me to leave?I don't wanna leave because I was just getting irritated.Jeez if anybody thinks they'll effect me in some way then they're insane.
EDIT:and emerald I can tell you're talking about me.it's obvious.I really wish I could have better people skills 'cause I'm always saying something that I always regret later.

Like that stupid I wanna be the one to post it

thing I posted a few days ago.

llarson wrote:

DEEMAN223344 wrote:

llarson wrote:DELETED DUE TO REGRET

Why do you want me to leave?I don't wanna leave because I was just getting irritated.Jeez if anybody thinks they'll effect me in some way then they're insane.

LEAVE NOW.

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I'm going to give my opinion on this subject, even though I don't take a part in it too much. I don't want to make anyone upset with this post, I'm just trying to help out.

Well, as SS01 said, Drago has recolored some of the game's textures for use in adventures, and even though I myself think they are really nice, the users that do make their own textures from scratch should get a little more appreciation for their work, but that totally depends if the texture is good or not. If it is not that good, one can tell the creator of the texture in a nice way that he/she should try to make it nicer, maybe even give tips on how to do that if that person knows.

I presume SS01 was just pointing out that what Drago does is recolor already made textures, not actually make them himself, and that he was not trying to be rude to Drago at all. While I think that Drago's response wasn't too rational, I believe that it's just a small

Wonderman, I don't think you have a bad attitude. It's just that over the internet it isn't as easy as usual to detect the tone of a post as it would be if you were actually speaking with a person. Sometimes one can come across as a bad person when you only were trying to be nice. It happens, so don't worry. A tip I would give you would be for you to not use a smiley all so often, because it kind of makes what you're trying to say a little rougher. That's my perspective, at least.

So, after writing all this, I think there was nothing wrong with SS01's post (or posts). I may be completely wrong on what the actual tone of the post was, but then, I can't be sure. In my experiences, I have never seen SS01 be rude or inappropriate. What I think is not too good is that some of the newer users (I'm not pointing fingers) have posted many times in a day, and sometimes it makes me feel like the forums are being spammed. But I guess I just have to get used to the increase in activity, because I was used to the more calm, quieter forums.

As for llarson, I think that you should double-check your posts before you submit them, just in case if something you say there comes across as rude or bad. I've seen that happen, but I don't think you're a bad person. I think you shouldn't leave the forums because of this, but I've tried stopping others from leaving and not succeeded. So it's up to you.

Again, I'm not trying to upset or hurt anyone, I'm just voicing my opinion on this.

I was just about to post a lot of clear responses to this, but I accidentally logged out and I'm not typing it all up again.

Everybody here needs to have patience, 1st of all. Don't clutter this topic with these issues too much or we could get a problem, 2nd.

OK?

TheThaumaturge wrote:While I think that Drago's response wasn't too rational, I believe that it's just a small

Small what?

StinkerSquad01 wrote:

TheThaumaturge wrote:While I think that Drago's response wasn't too rational, I believe that it's just a small

Small what?

Darn it, I didn't finish that. I meant to say that it's not that much of a big deal.

Sorry if my post was stupid.I was just in a bad mood.

Going to drop my own two cents here. For starters...

Wonderman109 wrote:He did work hard on it like I worked hard on my WACC2 and MNIK told me it was unacceptable. I was cool with it, DD isn't apparently. But he's not completely at fault and he at least tried. Don't blame him entirely or he'll want to quit like you do right now.

If you're referring to the recolor textures, I'm going to have to cut in here and say no, that's not a lot of work. If I wanted to, I could do that in GIMP in five or ten minutes, and I hardly know my way around it.

To be honest - and I mean no offense to Drago or anyone else, honest - it has kinda bugged me. I didn't want to bring it up because I didn't want to be seen as rude. If the texture looks nice? Then fine, I'm not going to tell him "Hey, this isn't your work to begin with, stop it," but when people are commenting on how great his work is and other texture makers get ignored? Yes, that irritates me quite a bit, to be honest.

Anyways!

To address the matter of MS Paint, it's not a bad tool by any stretch. It's far better suited to things like pixel art than tools like GIMP or Paint.NET from my experience. The matter comes down to how you use it. If you're using it properly, it can actually be quite a powerful tool. Saying that? It does require knowledge as to what you're doing.

I'm working on a Minecraft texture pack right now, using MS Paint. It's definitely more suited to pixel-y environments than WA is, but the point remains - it can still look good.

The only limits to just about any art software is your knowledge of it. Do I know how to use GIMP? Very basically. Could I get by with what I know? Depends. I can create a water texture, for instance. Do I trust my skill with it enough to make a custom WA texture? No, no I do not. MS Paint? Yes, actually, I know how to use Paint quite a bit (BTW, the Windows Vista version of Paint is actually the best, IMO) when it comes down to it. Better than GIMP? Yes. Could I make a water texture in Paint? No, I'm not that good at pixel art. Could I make a good WA level texture if motivated? Probably.

So no, I don't think "getting rid of Paint" will solve any problems with texture quality, as it's not the core of the problem. I think the reason people use Paint over other programs is that it's much more user-friendly. Finding an image on the net probably isn't a good place to start, honestly. Chances are it won't tile (I know this all too well) or will look quite nasty when scaled down to fit the custom texture. Best thing I can recommend?

Learn how to use your tools, regardless of if it's MS Paint, GIMP 2.8, Adobe Photoshop, whatever. The more you know, the better you can use them.


Putting that aside, next issue: Younger members.

I do not inherently have a problem here. Wonderland is a very kid-friendly series, and posting a warning saying "13+ only, otherwise go ask your parents" isn't guaranteed to do much.

I'm not very good with kids (in real life), to be honest. I feel very awkward and unsure of what to say, moreso than around other people. I don't mean that to say "no younger kids, this is for adults only >:|", I mean that's why I'm a bit quieter these days. Saying that, the main reason I've posted less is actually something else: I'm tired of this whole "follow the leader" trend that I'm seeing in the Off-Topic section.

I don't mean this in a negative way to anyone involved, but I'm seeing that a lot of trends are started by MNIK. He'll make a game or something, and everyone will start copying that idea and running wild with it. Is that a bad thing? Not inherently, no, but to be honest? I think it's gotten to a bit of a ridiculous degree. One of my friends (who's registered on this forum, not naming him unless he's alright with it) put it this way (and I agree with him); "Basically it's at this point: if MNIK isn't interested in it, no-one else is."

That's not to say that MNIK doesn't have good ideas, mind! I think almost all of his ideas are great (though I might have been one of the most vocal people complaining about Boxinator, I loved the idea and how puzzles could be built around it). Saying that, yes, it does bug me that when he comes up with something, everyone immediately follows suit.

Having said that, I don't inherently put that down to younger members. I don't think that kind of discrimination is called for at all on a board like this.

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Oh man, I missed these ragey debate threads!

DEEMAN223344 wrote:

Qloof234 wrote: I'm tired of this whole "follow the leader" trend that I'm seeing in the Off-Topic section.

I don't mean this in a negative way to anyone involved, but I'm seeing that a lot of trends are started by MNIK. He'll make a game or something, and everyone will start copying that idea and running wild with it. Is that a bad thing? Not inherently, no, but to be honest? I think it's gotten to a bit of a ridiculous degree. One of my friends (who's registered on this forum, not naming him unless he's alright with it) put it this way (and I agree with him); "Basically it's at this point: if MNIK isn't interested in it, no-one else is."

That's not to say that MNIK doesn't have good ideas, mind! I think almost all of his ideas are great (though I might have been one of the most vocal people complaining about Boxinator, I loved the idea and how puzzles could be built around it). Saying that, yes, it does bug me that when he comes up with something, everyone immediately follows suit.

This, this all the way.
No offense to MNIK, but REALLY. MNIK's common excuse though, is "no one else has finsihed and game so thats why"

Hey, I was never trying to run a monopoly thing in the first place. After I designed some games for fun, a lot of you guys just decided I was cool or something. And no, I'm not trying to defend my position. It kind of pisses me off that you're making me sound like I'm so egotistical all the time. Besides, it's not MY fault that people get inspired by my work and make their own knockoffs.

DEEMAN223344 wrote:MNIK's common excuse though, is "no one else has finsihed and game so thats why"

How many times have I said that? Once that I recall? Three months ago? AS A JOKE?

Why do all of you keep saying my popularity is just because of my games, anyways? I've done a lot more in terms of Wonderland, and if you don't believe me I'll provide some examples.

DEEMAN223344 wrote:Hmm...
Have you forgotten Blast!10 and Jdl? They finished quite a few games. And what happened? They were overshadowed by MNIK.
Someone please stop ignoring them.

Overshadowed, mainly because most of their games are very old. Not to mention they're kind of hard to notice when the developers are almost never around anymore.

Be honest here. No one ever talks about the first four Evil Toaster games anymore. Evil Toaster 5 has been in a consistent development cycle for a year, and thus has built up hype for the finished product.

DEEMAN223344 wrote:I am guilty of this myself, however I have discovered how BORING it is to be milking the same idea over and over again, which MNIK is also feeling.

Milking? Each installment of Evil Toaster has introduced something new. I was only tired of the series recently because I was destroyed by school and other things, but now I'm beginning to feel like working on it again. The only real thing that I've been milking from Evil Toaster is your destructive criticism.

DEEMAN223344 wrote:Too bad some others don't (yes, you capcom). The thing is, this whole thing isn't MNIK's fault. It's the zombies that insist that he's a god or something; It's cbloopy all over again (I also have nothing against him, although he kinda disappeared).

Cbloopy was so popular because he contributed a lot to the community. That's the same reason I became popular.

I don't think I'm better than anyone else either. I would be pretty mad if the "zombies" ran around saying that I was the best, but no one does that anyways.

DEEMAN223344 wrote:That said, you guys REALLY need to get off those external forums. I'm fine with the chat, I love the chat. But Wonderforum? 3.studio? Dark Drago Forums? Epigam? Really? What's wrong with this one?

I created Epigam to be a forum that's specifically geared to showcasing games, not to "get away" from this forum.

DEEMAN223344 wrote:It may also be a cause of this whole follow-the-leader thing, considering all other designers hide away in those sites.

They all seem really inactive right now.

DEEMAN223344 wrote:If I see another external forum, I will scream....

So what? Did you basically write your post to piss and moan about how I've gotten a good reputation from giving everyone free entertainment?

STOP FIGHTING

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